GEOFF BENNETT: The Washington Post is laying# off a third of its work force across both the## newsroom and its business operations,# a massive blow at a storied newspaper## that has struggled in recent years to# stay profitable and retain subscribers.## The cuts reportedly affect more than 300# of the approximately 800 journalists in## the newsroom and include eliminating its# sports desk and books section entirely.

The Post's executive editor said the changes,## though painful, were meant to -- quote# -- "reinvent the paper for a new era."

For more on these cuts and their# implications, we're joined now by## Marty Baron, who was the editor of The# Washington Post from 2012 until 2021.

Welcome back to the "News Hour."

MARTY BARON, Former Executive Editor, The# Washington Post: Thanks for having me.

GEOFF BENNETT: You have described this as# among the darkest da.. What do these layoffs mean for the paper's mission## and its ability to continue doing# in-depth, substantial reporting?

MARTY BARON: Well, I think it's important to# keep in mind just how widespread these cuts are,## not only the sports desk, the books department,# but pretty much the entire arts department,## eviscerating the foreign staff, largely# eviscerating the local staff as well.

So these are huge, huge cuts, and they're going to## be -- they're going to do enormous damage to# the newspaper's ability to cover its community,## to cover the country, and to cover the# world in all the ways that it should.

GEOFF BENNETT: The executive editor, Matt Murray,## said today that the paper's structure was built# for a different era and that refocusing on## what he calls these core coverage areas like# politics and national security will help The## Post better navigate technological change,# shifting audience habits, cost pressures.

Do you buy that argument?

MARTY BARON: Well, I think Matt is# doing a really good job as editor## of The Post.

The Post is doing# extraordinary journalism every## single day.

And I commend them for# that.

I admire what they're doing.

That said, they have announced -- they seem# to have announced a new strategy just about## once a year now, saying that it would better# position themselves for the future.

And none## of those things have worked.

I don't think what# they're doing now helps position them for the## future.

It diminishes the brand.

It diminishes# the coverage.

It offers less to their readers.

They're going to have fewer subscribers# as a result of this, probably not more.

So## I understand why Matt is saying that.# He has to say something positive about## what's happening.

But I don't think# there's very much positive to say.

GEOFF BENNETT: You served as editor under Jeff# Bezos back in 2013 when he purchased the paper## and pledged long-term investment and support for# the newsroom.

What do you make of what appears to## be a shift in both his relationship to the paper# and his willingness to invest in its future?

MARTY BARON: Well, he was great at# the beginning, and for a long time,## as a matter of fact.

He set out a vision for The# Post to be national and international, as opposed## to regional, which it was largely before.

He# invested heavily in The Post.

We innovated## tremendously over the years.

We grew tremendously# as well, practically doubling the staff.

And we were profitable for about six# straight years.

And so that was a lot## of progress.

He was proud of it.

He spoke# proudly of it.

And so now we're seeing a## diminished outlook.

And I think that he# became sort of detached in about 2019,## when his marriage broke up, when# Amazon was struggling later in 2020,## when the -- Amazon was struggling with# the pandemic and all the aspects of that.

And then I think he really became -- took# a real turn after it looked like Trump## was going to be elected president yet again.# And that was in 2024.

And 11 days before the## presidential election in 2024, they# killed an editorial for -- that was## endorsing Kamala Harris.

He said the paper# wouldn't endorse ever again for president.

And hundreds of thousands of# subscribers canceled at that time,## aggravating the financial problems# that they had.

Subsequent to that,## he did all sorts of things that made things# even worse, appearing at the inauguration on## the stage with Donald Trump, buying the Melania# so-called documentary for an exorbitant price,## buying the right -- Amazon buying# the rights to "The Apprentice."

And Amazon had bought the rights to Melania's# documentary as well.

And then completely## changing the opinion pages so that essentially# they have no columnists who are really left## of center.

And they're very deferential to# Trump.

And I think they lack a moral core.

And so all of that has driven subscribers# away.

And so for every subscriber that## they get coming in through the front door# because of the high-quality news coverage,## I think they're losing maybe two# subscribers out the back door.

Of course,## I don't know the numbers exactly, but clearly# they have been losing a lot of subscribers.

GEOFF BENNETT: Why does an institution like The## Washington Post matter at# this moment in particular?

MARTY BARON: Look, I think# it's the reason that every## news organization matters.

It's an organization.

I think the role of a news organization is to give# the public the information it needs and deserves## to know so that they can govern themselves.# The Washington Post has a long history of that,## and particularly of holding the government to# account, keeping a close eye on government.

That happened, of course, during Watergate.# I think we did that when I was editor on## the first round of the -- Trump's time in the# White House, his first term.

And they continue## to do that today.

I think they're doing a# tremendous job of that.

People need to know## what's happening in their government.

They need to# know what's happening in the corridors of power,## whether in government or in business or# in nonprofits or wherever it might be.

And they need to know what's happening# around the world.

So if you don't have## reporters around the world, you're not# going to know what's happening.

And we## need more than one news organization doing that.# We need multiple news organizations doing that.

So, look, the press is built into our democracy.# It is provided for in the First Amendment to the## Constitution because the founders understood# that you needed an institution that would keep## watch on government.

And James Madison, who# was the principal author of that amendment,## talked about the need for freely# examining public characters and measures.

We are not stenographers and we should not# be propagandists.

And that is the role that## The Washington Post has historically played, and# that's the role that it should continue to play.

GEOFF BENNETT: Marty Baron, thank you for# your time this evening.

We appreciate it.

MARTY BARON: Thank you.